hobaggins @ May 23 2003, 13:45:17 UTC *blinks innocently*

Are you suggesting she wear her robes to bed?

*whistles innocently*

notapipe @ May 23 2003, 13:48:46 UTC Re: *blinks innocently*

No. I'm saying she should bring muffins to bed with her.

luxuryrevenge @ Deleted Deleted

Deleted

notapipe @ May 23 2003, 14:15:01 UTC

I agree with you. HOWEVER:

Let's try a little experiment. Let's replace "Pansy" with "Draco", replace "she" with "he", replace "her" with "his" and "him", replace "evil mother" with "shitty mother", replace "mistreated by Draco" with "mistreated by Lucius" and replace "M.B." and "Millie" with "Harry".

You know, he's the only character I don't really have sympathy for. Even with the stuff about his shitty mother and being mistreated by Lucius, I only like him in the context of his relationship with Harry. It's there that he had the potential to be unselfish. I want them to be together, but Harry isn't in a forgiving mood, and I don't know that Draco actually understands concepts like "right" and "wrong." I can't tell if he even misses Harry, or is he is just put out that he is not particularly missed.

Seems pretty accurate, if condemning, of shortly post-outing!Draco. Draw your own conclusions.

luxuryrevenge @ Deleted Deleted

Deleted

notapipe @ May 23 2003, 16:53:34 UTC

I would write more, but there's a reason I don't do serious discussion. I'm lazy.

I hear ya sister. With the exception of Evil!Neville, I'm generally too lazy to write much or attempt serious conversation as well.

sistermagpie @ May 23 2003, 14:41:11 UTC

LOL--I was making the same connection.

I have a hard time having a real opinion on Pansy because she's such a cypher, but the thing with her mother is the one thing that seemed to be something she honestly felt and I'm definitely on her side about that. The thing with Pansy is that she rarely asks for or needs sympathy--usually she's the one who comes out of everything unscathed. But I was happy when Draco made up with M.B., and if M.B. and Pansy make up I'll be happy for them too. It would be great if she and Draco both helped each other become independent from their controlling parent.

I admit when Pansy said Draco had offered to owl her mother about Pansy being more than just his girlfriend I hoped that was for real. We have very little idea of exactly what Draco and Pansy's relationship is--maybe they have more in common than we think. M.B. tried to run Pansy over with the tank, but then she also tried to bean Draco with a few bludgers.

Really, I was the most happy when the three of them were all sleeping in the bed together. I want the Unholy Trio back together. If Pansy has to go through a little trouble to get it that can only be good for her, like it was for Draco.

black_dog @ May 23 2003, 18:12:59 UTC

We have very little idea of exactly what Draco and Pansy's relationship is

I admit I pretty much see Pansy as a villain -- in that she's consistently willing to be an enabler for Draco when he's running away from real emotional challenges. Also because she was willing to sacrifice her relationship with Millicent to grab a chance for a socially rewarding but sham relationship with Draco.

I thought this was a beautiful thread, though, for the way it suggested a lot of backstory and outlined the emotional terms of a reconciliation between Pansy and Millicient. It feels like Pansy has finally realized that Draco needs to walk away from her -- or at least is going to walk away from her. She's acknowledging her failure, here, she's acknowledging that the sham has also left her unsatisfied, and she's wondering if Millicent will have her back. And Millicent's response is, as usual, very carefully calibrated. She's ready to forgive, but Pansy is going to have to make the concession -- Pansy is going to have to come to Millicent's bed.

Now, if only I could understand what Millicent sees in Pansy . . .

notapipe @ May 23 2003, 18:18:20 UTC

Personally, I'd settle for understanding what Harry sees in Draco.

black_dog @ May 23 2003, 18:30:53 UTC

Interesting. I was raising this very question with Verdant, here. What do you think?

petitemillicent @ May 24 2003, 02:12:37 UTC

She is hot.

M. B.

notapipe @ May 24 2003, 02:17:49 UTC BY JOVE, I THINK SHE'S GOT IT!

This is true.

This also explains Harry's infatuation with Draco.

petitemillicent @ May 24 2003, 02:20:36 UTC Re: BY JOVE, I THINK SHE'S GOT IT!

Harry also needs new glasses.

M. B.

notapipe @ May 24 2003, 02:25:48 UTC Re: BY JOVE, I THINK SHE'S GOT IT!

And a new style. He definetly should go for the Emo glasses.

black_dog @ May 24 2003, 03:58:11 UTC Re: BY JOVE, I THINK SHE'S GOT IT!

*shrugs* Some people like pointy and angular. Go figure.

notapipe @ May 24 2003, 12:30:31 UTC Re: BY JOVE, I THINK SHE'S GOT IT!

*ahem* I think you mean classic.

black_dog @ May 23 2003, 18:27:37 UTC

I don't know, I think Draco is a much, much more attractive character than Pansy. As messed up as he is, he seems to have an immensely greater capacity for both pleasing and being pleased -- I'm thinking of his extroversion, his playfulness, his energy, his emotional intensity, his wit and intelligence. Pansy is constantly making grim calculations of bloodless social advantage. She's a much more crabbed and narrow personality than Draco, and seems fundamentally joyless.

With Draco, you want him to get straightened out because so much seems at stake, both in terms of his own and other people's happiness. With Pansy, you don't get the same sense of a greater potential. Though her relationship with Millicient remains a wild card.

I love the way she's played, though -- she's a fascinating character.

ex_meiko437 @ May 23 2003, 19:55:09 UTC

I was just going to post something like this in response!

Exactly, exactly what I was thinking.. with Draco, you catch the snipets of his underlying potential, and he endears himself to you with his transparent snarkyness and his overall wit. With Pansy, everything is very calculated, and she's EXTREMELY slippery. With Draco, he has his redeeming qualities and his slip ups that make him human and on the level with everynoe else, while still being incredibly intriguing and entertaining. With Pansy, there is none of the warmth, humor, or energy that Draco has. Everything is very cold and mechanically calculated. You really can never tell what her agenda is, but you always know that she has one.

But I'm very glad that her and Millicent are back to sleeping in bed together, and I enjoy your theory on that.

black_dog @ May 23 2003, 20:27:25 UTC Re:

I'm very glad that her and Millicent are back to sleeping in bed together

Maybe this way, she'll be more inclined to let Draco alone, too, just in case she's tempted to intervene again.

amariel @ May 24 2003, 01:39:55 UTC

Pansy is constantly making grim calculations of bloodless social advantage. She's a much more crabbed and narrow personality than Draco, and seems fundamentally joyless.
I agree with all you said about Pansy vs Draco. But I do think there's more to Pansy than meets the eye, as showed in the baking mania. I loved that one. In my eyes manic!Pansy in a baking rage didn't seem that calculated and showed a crack in her carefully put-together front. What's behind that is hard to tell. If Millicent's anger formed a tank, I'm afraid to think what Pansy's would have been...
And I think Millicent draws out the best in her.

notapipe @ May 24 2003, 02:22:51 UTC Who you gonna call?

If Millicent's anger formed a tank, I'm afraid to think what Pansy's would have been...

A giant Stay-Puffed Marshmallow Man?

Alternatively, do they have the Pillsbury Doughboy in wizarding england?

amariel @ May 24 2003, 02:34:18 UTC Re: Who you gonna call?

A giant Stay-Puffed Marshmallow Man?
I wouldn't be surprised.
Or maybe a really huge Nigella Lawson dipping the students in chocolate before munching on them.

*sorry, should lay off crack now*

delirieuse @ May 24 2003, 04:46:05 UTC Re: Who you gonna call?

Mmmm, Nigella Lawson.

*blinks* I'm sorry, what were we talking about?

black_dog @ May 24 2003, 04:06:54 UTC

I do think there's more to Pansy than meets the eye

Well, probably, although she works so hard to seem smarmy all the way down. As for the baking obsession, I took it to mean that under the cool, competent political persona, there was a desparately crazed housewife trying to emerge.

But you're right about Millicent bringing something out of her, if anyone does. Or at least seeing something in her. (Perhaps, in fact, just that she's hot.) It's the one thing that points to unsuspected depths.

Anonymous @ May 23 2003, 15:15:10 UTC

HI!

I missed the past few weeks of NA and I am REALLY CONFUSED. Can someone help me out???

First, why are you assuming that she means Draco in her post about the bed? From my knowledge, they never slept in the same bed except that one time M.B. taped Draco to their bedpost.

Second, why are M.B. and Pansy fighting?

Third, are M.B. and Terry Boot dating?

Can someone please tell me? Thank you so much. I am so lost right now though I am trying to catch up :) :) :)

Also from reading these comments, I would like to say I personally think that Pansy and her mother are alike, and that her mum isn't necessarily that awful to her. They don't get along, but a lot of kids and their folks don't.

sistermagpie @ May 23 2003, 15:22:50 UTC

From what I understand:

1. I think most people are assuming she's referring to M.B. sharing her bed and not Draco, though since Draco is supposedly Pansy's boyfriend she may be posting this referring to Draco's not paying attention to her as well. (He's also the one who needs his feet covered at night, I believe.) I think M.B., Pansy and Draco actually did end up sleeping together after M.B. untaped him, but Pansy and Draco have never, as far as we know, shared a bed alone.

2. Pansy and M.B. appear to be fighting because she and Draco are going out.

3. M.B. and Terry had a date which left Terry unconscious and during which M.B. told him to ride her like a bad bad pony. M.B. is a whole lotta woman!

I don't think Pansy's mum is awful to her either--but I do think she's probably more traditional and thinks Pansy should aspire to a good marriage and not her own career. Pansy has my sympathy in wanting something different.

Anonymous @ May 23 2003, 15:28:32 UTC

:) THANKS, that helped a lot, and you're right, they did think it was M.B. for some reason my eyes played tricks on me.

hobaggins @ May 23 2003, 15:53:02 UTC

WAH! squee! *hearts pansy and M.B.*

xnera @ May 23 2003, 16:17:58 UTC

And just when I thought I was mistaken to make this icon, Pansy once again proves that said icon is relevant after all.

Anonymous @ May 23 2003, 16:22:07 UTC

I LOVE YOUR ICON <3

hobaggins @ May 23 2003, 16:35:19 UTC

*hearts icon*

sistermagpie @ May 23 2003, 16:54:39 UTC

LOL! Go Pansy! Warm toes for everyone!!

And Draco truly is wandering around all night now.

Anonymous @ May 24 2003, 13:22:31 UTC

Speaking of icons, does anything think that it's significant that Pansy is wooing Millicent while using her Draco's Girlfriend icon? Granted, it is her default icon, but it seemed a little counterproductive. Also, it seems that after she stopped using it, Millicent became much more cooperative.

-HedgeMouse

notapipe @ May 24 2003, 14:11:52 UTC

I did an analysis of the icons, but apparently that comment was lost. I'll redo it.

So basically Pansy is using her default icon to woo M.B. (hover over, you can see it's not deliberate), and just being insensitive in the beginning. M.B. also uses HER default icon, until she responds, negatively with her "LEAVE" icon, probably kinda pissed off at Pansy's icon, and at Pansy's general mistreatment of her. After this, Pansy seems to notice her faux pas and the fact that Millicent won't just roll over and makes the submissive move of suggesting a move to M.B.'s bed and switches to her (what I'll call) seductive icons. True, "I have breasts and you don't" is kinda wrong there, but no matter, and after it she uses the "Hey baby you're cute". M.B. responds more favorably to this new way, and uses a non-default icon, putting the effort in to it. And then they go cuddle. The icons reflect the tone of the dicussion very well, I think.

ex_meiko437 @ May 23 2003, 19:58:26 UTC

hmm.. curious..

What is Draco doing all night? It's obviously not sleeping with Harry.. far too soon for that..

what else could it possibly be? I wonder if there are clues that I'm missing.

notapipe @ May 23 2003, 21:24:39 UTC

Well, they could be playing golf.

ex_meiko437 @ May 23 2003, 23:02:47 UTC

that would be quite interesting. Gulf at 2 am. That would explain the grass stains (despite them already being explained, but we can ignore that.)

notapipe @ May 24 2003, 01:15:38 UTC

Well, they could charm the ball to give off light, and then when they sort of lost it they could take to their brooms and look for it from the air because Gulf is really a stupid sport anyway.

moojja @ May 24 2003, 01:31:12 UTC

I must have missed that, how did the grass stain came about?