karabou @ April 16 2003, 20:22:17 UTC

I hope it's a front, too.. because Lupin's story was so personal, and he really deserves a lot more respect. Even from Draco.

sistermagpie @ April 16 2003, 20:26:09 UTC

I'm surprised at how...really really angry I am at him for leaving! The more I think about it the angrier I get. I just...for probably a lot of reasons I'm furious with him. And kind of surprised too, really, because I'd think he'd be interested to watch.

I really do hope that his running was because it did strike a chord with him and he's processing it somewhere. Somebody please come up with a good spin on this.

non_inferno @ April 16 2003, 20:36:55 UTC

Somewhat good spin: Draco is scared because he realizes that all of his beliefs and prejudices really have come from his father. He needs to reevaluate but also has to keep up his image. So he leaves and makes his 'Lupin was trying to kill us and I could have broken a nail' post, which is supposed to make him sound indifferent to the situation, but instead makes him sound like an insensitive coward.

Or maybe not.

milenalupin @ April 17 2003, 01:10:42 UTC

Agreed.

Did you notice, how short his post actually was?
Usually, if something happens that needs to be explained in order to 'keep his face', he rants over half my friends list page (no offence meant, potterstinks.
He's very silent for a person who just ran off scared, though being a "wizard of extraordinary powerful descendance", a prefect, recently admonished by his father to finally prove his worthiness, and therefore expected to stay.

I think the transformation made a strong impression on him, and he doesn't know yet how to deal with it. (Won't help that Hero!Harry stayed over the full session, thus proving once again who is the stronger one of these two. Not good for PS's self-confidence.)

elessaria @ April 16 2003, 20:34:05 UTC

I just growled at ps' post. I did.

It was completely disrespectful for him to leave, especially after Lupin's last post. I'm agreeing with everyone and really, really hoping something affected him so much that he had to flee.

::Holds out hope that j_h will smack ps upside head::

nefeleo @ April 16 2003, 20:35:04 UTC

Personally, I'd bet PS was just scared stinkless. He's covering for it, as usual. *rolls eyes* I wouldn't call the act of running away 'keeping [one's] cool'.

sistermagpie @ April 16 2003, 21:19:46 UTC

Normally I would agree but this just seems too cowardly--really too fraidy cat--for him. Lupin's in a cage and the whole thing is in a controlled environment. And ps is standing next to girls who are watching. For a teenaged boy to run in that kind of situation...it's just too babyish. I can't imagine any boy who would do it. He'd be a laughing stock.

Although I have no other explanation, I'm hoping there is something more than meets the eye that made him personally afraid not of Lupin attacking him but of some kind of phobia or new understanding. Because although I can certainly imagine Draco being afraid in many many many situations, I can't wrap my mind around him being afraid of a class demonstration of a man turning into a wolf in a controlled situation. Not the point of running, anyway. He might have found it truly horrifying but what's to flee from?

ex_meiko437 @ April 16 2003, 20:39:39 UTC

I really am angry at Draco for leaving, but I do have a theory on this..

He pretends to genuinely dislike Lupin and anything Gryffindor (sans.. possibly Harry at this point) for the fear of family retribution, but I have a hunch that he really took it in and was made completely uncomfortable by an emotional display that actually broke through his finely crafted mask.

I think, and this is only my theory (might be wrong! ^^), that he left for fear of emotionally reacting in some way to Lupin's tale, and then having to own up to it with his fellow housemates.

At least, I believe that's what the subtext leads to. He seems too angry.

milenalupin @ April 17 2003, 01:20:55 UTC

I agree.
And maybe he's not only reacting to what Lupercus said, his general kindness, especially after Lucius morally smacked Draco down, - but also to the torture and pain, the suffering he has to watch.

Potterstinks seems very spoiled and sheltered to me. I think seeing a person suffer like that (plus, one he seccretly likes) is something he has to learn to cope with.

Anonymous @ April 16 2003, 21:17:32 UTC *SIGH*

I think he was scared, but that doesn't mean I'm happy with him. It's posts like this that remind me of how Draco really is in canon, and just how brilliantly and realistically his player is portraying him. I remember that I hate this kid. I love the snarkiness because it's amusing, but he's really an ASS...but it's fun to hate him. Heh. He's just so....AARRRGGGHHH! *pulls hair* WAKE UP WILL YOU PLEASE!!! >:O

I wonder if J_H will say anything to him...

sistermagpie @ April 16 2003, 21:26:47 UTC Re: *SIGH*

See but, this doesn't sound like canon!Draco to me. The git part, yes, that does. But when has Draco ever run out of a class? He ran in the FF and from the Dementors but those were situations where he was confronted by something in the world. In class I think he would always put on a front of not being scared--remember when Hagrid was first taking them into the forest Draco was obviously scared but tried to cover it up by scaring Neville. This is a kid who does not like to show fear. This is exactly the kind of situation, imo, canon!Draco would use to pretend to be tough and show he's not afraid of werewolves (when they're in a cage). Emotionally upset for reasons unknown I can accept. Refusing to show he's affected by Lupin's story I can accept. Scared because Professor Lupin growled and shook the bars...no.

Anonymous @ April 16 2003, 21:40:22 UTC Re: *SIGH*

The git part, yes, that does. But when has Draco ever run out of a class? He ran in the FF and from the Dementors but those were situations where he was confronted by something in the world. In class I think he would always put on a front of not being scared

yes, but the class lecture and the actual transformation are i think two separate events. draco ran away in the forest because he was confronted with something scary that he had no control over and seeing lupin turn into a werewolf would be the same sort of thing. something very scary that he'd never seen before and couldn't handle. it really doesn't have to be anything deeper than him just being scared witless by a captive werewolf. he's really kind of a pansy, like that, i think.

:-)

sistermagpie @ April 16 2003, 21:46:25 UTC Re: *SIGH*

Pansy or not he's a 16-year-old boy. Running out of a class? When everyone else is able to take it? I can't believe it. This is the kind of situation where he would look scared but fiercely try to deny it. He knew what was going to happen and it was in a controlled environment. In this situation, barring any unknown factors, I think pride would absolutely win out.

bookshop @ April 16 2003, 22:17:15 UTC Re: *SIGH*

But when has Draco ever run out of a class? He ran in the FF and from the Dementors but those were situations where he was confronted by something in the world.

Yes, but for one thing, we only see Draco in classes with Harry, and he only has Potions and CoMC with Harry. In Potions class, why on earth would he run out? Snape will protect him from whatever happens, and if anybody has reasons to be scared it's Harry, not Draco. In CoMC, as you've said, he's been overtly terrified, and he tries to cover it up with bravado--but whenever that happens he gets punished or gets paid back for it or horribly embarrassed; cf. the Hippogryff incident, and the ferret incident. I personally think the Ferrett incident is Draco's finest moment because he handles himself with dignity; but still his first impulse is to beat a hasty retreat, whether of embarrassment or fear.

In fact he usually retreats first. His first major act of bravado is to challenge Harry to a duel to which he doesn't show up. His first instinct whenever he sees a teacher around is to back off; his first instinct when Harry pelts him with mud is to scream bloody murder and run away; his first instinct when (if I may take the liberty to use the movie, though I know this is a stretch) he heard about the troll was to scream and run away.

I personally think Melpomene's point below about his impulsiveness is excellent. He's kind of a loose cannon (arguably Hotspur to Harry's Henry) in that he just does things without thinking, and *then* winds up having to justify them, if not to the world, at least to himself. In the Forbidden Forest in Book 1, Draco first blurts out "The forest?" in fear, and then tries to cover for it by stating that it's against the rules--much like he's doing now by claiming moral objections to hide his fear after the fact. Later, although he runs, in the movie version of events, he runs for help--again, an impulsive reaction tempered by serious track-covering.

Sure, this is a kid who doesn't like to show fear--what kid does?--but he's also a kid who fails miserably at attempts to cover it. Just think about his reaction to Harry's Patronus; and also, the way he reacted to the sight of the Dementors--Gred and Feorge said that he was half-scared out of his wits. Of course Draco seizes on the chance to make fun of Harry to cover up his own blunders--he has to, because he blunders again and again.

And let's not forget the fact that in NA Potterstinks' first reaction is always to run, or to hide. Just in the past couple of weeks we've seen all kinds of examples of this: he first hides from the world after Colin's post, then backtracks and finds Millicent-Pansy doubles to hang out with; he fails to show up for the duel, and then claims to have overslept because it was such a trivial event; and finally he panicks on the streets of London and winds up attempting to buy a bag of bats to protect himself with. When Queenie tried to give him head, he kneed her in the face and ran away, hahaha. And, hee, my personal favorite example, during the Hogsmeade brawl back in the fall, Draco's first instinct was to make a mad dash for the door, and he would have but for Harry's dragging him under the table to protect him. (AWWWW.)

I just think that, while Sister M's point about him wanting to hide his fear is very accurate, her timing is off. From what I think we've seen of Draco, and Potterstinks in particular, he tends to react impulsively, and *then* hide his fear after the fact.

notapipe @ April 17 2003, 06:35:23 UTC Re: *SIGH*

he only has Potions and CoMC with Harry

And apart from DADA, what class could possibly more terrifying than Hagrid's CoMC?

Draco is certianly not foolishly brave, he runs from things. But he's not so much a coward, what he runs from are genuinely scary. The Forbidden Forest is Forbidden for a very good reason, there are some really dangerous things there. Voldemort, the most evil wizard of their time, feasting on a unicorn, is the sort of thing that no sane person with a functioning brain would stick around for. When faced with Dementors, or a giant stag charging at a suicidal pace right at you, maybe you SHOULDN'T sit there and take your demise bravely. He who turns and runs away, lives and all that.

Lupin's transformation isn't exactly the sort of situation where Draco needs to fear for his life, there would be plenty of Griffindors sitting too close to the cage for Lupin to eat before he got to Draco. So I think Draco has to afraid of something else, of some more personal fear.

sistermagpie @ April 17 2003, 06:49:20 UTC Re: *SIGH*

I'm so glad you guys are here to talk about with! Both of you make really good points. Because I really am trying to put my finger on how I feel about this. I loved Susan Bones' post, btw. It was so sweet and real.

I do agree with everything vanityfair and also agree about Draco's impulsiveness. I do think it's part of his character to retreat first, absolutely. He's not at all somebody who's going to step forward just to show courage. When he feels danger he hides and I don't really mind that about him. Even in this situation, I think he'd be one of the students who most wanted to run.

But I also agree with notapipe--that's what's tripping me up. This is a situation where Draco is sitting towards the back in a room full of people. I would guess he did that on purpose. He knew what he was going into, even if of course he had no idea how bad it would be. So I just feel like there had to be some other element in play here, other than just being scared of a monster, you know? Some powerful feeling he wasn't expecting and had no ability to deal with at all.

One thing about Hermione's post that I loved was that she was so detached. Not completely cold, but able to watch it from a scientific pov. She even starts out by saying she hopes she doesn't sound heartless because I think she may feel a little guilty about her detachment (I know the feeling, Hermione!). This tranformation and the lesson leading up to it were just so emotional more than anything I feel like that had to be a factor.

bookshop @ April 16 2003, 22:32:05 UTC Re: *SIGH*

pssst! want an LJ code? :)

Anonymous @ April 17 2003, 09:56:51 UTC :)

eep! I saw this late! :( I don't know if you'll even see this, but if you do I would love a code. :) Thanks! <3

splitskirt22@yahoo.com

Meg

moonlitpages @ April 16 2003, 21:32:10 UTC

Hmm, I was a little disappointed in Draco's reaction to the lesson as well, however, I can't help but think perhaps expectations for his reaction were a bit too high. As much as I would love to see something like this get through to Draco, I think that even if it did, he's not likely to admit it on a public forum such as this. I also think that perhaps his fleeing in terror doesn't necessarily mean Lupin's words didn't get through to him, as was suggested above. One of the things that I have always adored about cannon!Draco, that I think potterstinks portrays quite perfectly, is that he is so honest in his immediate reactions to things. He doesn't think, he just reacts. When he is scared, he runs away (ala PS/SS and PoA). When he is angry, he flings a curse in the middle of the damn hallway without any care to the fact that professors might be around (ala GoF). He seems to give in to that fight or flight instinct rather readily, and though I think potterstinks has definitely evolved his character a bit from the books, it seems he is still not beyond this. It is only afterwards that he overcompensates to attempt to cover up his lapse of that cold Malfoy veneer that Lucius displays so effortlessly. I think this is much the same thing happening here- PS saw Lupin changing, and panicked. It is only afterwards in the comfort of the computer lab that he tries to explain his actions with some kind of calm disdain to cover for it.

Well, that's my interpretation at any rate, but I just adore Cannon!Draco and potterstinks to pieces in all their snotty glory so, don't mind me ;-)

sistermagpie @ April 16 2003, 21:41:37 UTC

Deleted my last post because upon re-reading Hermione's post it was completely wrong. No longer feel better.

moonlitpages @ April 16 2003, 21:50:12 UTC

Hmmm, and you know- reading Hermione's post, also got me thinking:

Body rigid, trembling uncontrollably
Body and limbs lengthening, curling
Tail! V. interesting!
Cage seems to be repelling Profess wolf -- (silver)
D. Malfoy already left running, looked v. scared

Here is Lupin out of control, a grown man that Draco probably respects at least somewhat no matter what he might want others to think. In his world, adults (ie: his father) maintain their composure at all times (well, unless he is berating Draco and apparently scaring the piss out of him though I have the feeling that Lucius could even make yelling at his son seem cold and effortless). I don't think Draco was prepared for this, and he just couldn't deal with it.

Anonymous @ April 16 2003, 21:56:38 UTC

Did anyone else notice that Lupin chewed on his leg AFTER Draco left the room (Draco left the room at 8:19 and Hermione records the leg-chewing at 8:20) and yet he writes about it in his journal.

Maybe he stayed at watched from a distance?

sistermagpie @ April 16 2003, 22:12:37 UTC

Hmmm. That's interesting. I'd like to think there's something more than meets the eye, that he really was trying to stay.

The thing is...it's not that I can't believe he was scared or that he ran. I just need some reason for it. Something other than "He's scared of everything." Because he's not. Not in canon and not here. There's a lot he is scared of, but he's not just afraid of his own shadow. There are many reasons I can imagine that Lupin's tranformation would be especially frightening for him--a calm person who then starts howling in pain; an authority figure turning into a monster; the sudden understanding that something he had always thought was the mark of a savage was actually painful and heartbreaking even to him; the sudden understanding that someone he's been cruel to can feel pain in a way that affects him; perhaps a real fear of his own anger that made this kind of thing frightening.

The only thing that doesn't ring true--and there's no reason as of yet to believe that this is the way the game is playing it--is to have him run as just another of ps's shallow quirks. This whole episode is too emotional and painful; not just because of Lupercus' beautiful posts but because of just how frightening and awesome the tranformation was supposed to be. I have a hard time believing ps was only affected superficially i.e., he saw a scary monster and decided it was dangerous (this is the boy who insults hypogryffs after all).

bookshop @ April 16 2003, 22:28:01 UTC

I just need some reason for it. Something other than "He's scared of everything." Because he's not. Not in canon and not here. There's a lot he is scared of, but he's not just afraid of his own shadow.

Hmm. I think--well, I wonder if this is important to you because you *want* him to be strong. Draco in canon is not a strong character. He's abominably weak; he only seems strongest after the fact of his greatest humiliations and that's maybe because we want him to be strong then, out of sympathy.

PS is not shallow, I don't think that at all; but I think that he reacts impulsively, and impulses are often out of character; they rarely reveal our truest potential. I think one reason we are rooting so much for PS is that we know he has so much potential, and we want him to live up to it; but in canon, again and again, he doesn't. For PS to run away is, I think, very canonical. At this point I wouldn't call him a strong person--he often does shallow things, both in canon and in NA. He has a strong, engaging personality, but it doesn't follow that he'll be consistently what we want him to be.

We all do out of character things. We don't have to know why he's scared of everything that moves for it to be believable, I don't think; fear is irrational, and very difficult to control. I think, personally, believing him as I do to be purely scared shitless, for whatever reason, that moments of weakness like this is what will ultimately make his growth as a character more fulfilling--and especially it's what makes him real to me.

Essentially, I love him in part because he disappoints me, because he doesn't often do the right thing or respond to things the way I think he should. He's a real boy.

moonlitpages @ April 16 2003, 23:00:25 UTC

Yes, exactly *seconds and thirds and fourths*. One of the things I most love about the character of Draco, both in the books and NA, is that he is not at all perfect. He has flaws, and shortcomings, that are obvious to everyone but himself. He not nearly as 'easy' to 'love' as Harry perhaps because it is much easier to see Harry as some kind of shining, perfect child if we are so inclined even though he isn't. You have to look much harder for Harry's faults, therefore making them easy to pretend they are not there at all and then when some people become aware of them they feel almost betrayed. I don't think it makes a character like Draco any less worth liking simply because it isn't easy to, or because the character has overt weaknesses that cannot be ignored. That's one of the things that draws me to a character, actually, but I've always had strange tastes. And now I'm just rambling off the original point entirely- sleep is good. ;-)

milenalupin @ April 17 2003, 01:46:05 UTC

He has flaws, and shortcomings, that are obvious to everyone but himself.

Actually, to me it seems that Canon!Draco as well as potterstinks are well aware of the character flaws. A lot of his actions seem the be just a cover-up for the fact that he is not what he wants himself to be. The boasting, the teasing, the whole "I-am-so-much-better-than-you" attitude looks like a desperate attempt to hide his insecurities, his jealousy, his self-consciousness.

As Aja said before, one of Canon!Draco's finest moments is his way to hold up his head and his dignity after The Ferret Incident. Generally, I love my Canon!Draco for all his Spoiled-Bratness, but in this moment, I respected him for his maturity and dignity. Which must have been a first in all the books. Wish I saw more of that.

But then, other than a lot of readers I don't have any problems to see Harry's flaws. He's lying, cheating, not obeying to rules, using bribe and blackmail, sometimes fighting dirty (invisibly throwing mud on another student is so much NOT FAIR) and doesn't trust. I don't know who invented Cheerful!Fair!UberGryffindor!Harry, but it surely wasn't JKR. She wrote him pretty Slytherinish.

sistermagpie @ April 17 2003, 07:01:22 UTC

Spamming this entire thread. Ha ha!

Yes, I do love him in the Ferret incident and I've always thought that it was important because it showed not that Draco was categorically "brave" but that there were certain situations that would make him suck it up. I think most bravery is like that, in fact. A person who is just brave for the point of being brave is usually an idiot. Most people work through their fear because there's something else that's more important. For Draco, it seems to me, being on display with other people around seems to have a huge affect on him, which is why I reacted badly to this scene. (In most other situations I honestly wouldn't think twice about him running out--in fact I'd be surprised if he didn't.) When he's first turned into a ferret he tries to run away but then, remember he's just become only a few inches tall. Plus it's humiliating to be a ferret in front of all these people.

But maybe I'm wrong in considering this such a public situation since all eyes were really on Lupin and Draco maybe thought he could slip out unnoticed. He may not have realized the family pride was at stake and in fact known that he could easily leave and still be considered brave by Lucius as long as he complained about the whole thing.

sistermagpie @ April 17 2003, 06:54:53 UTC

You're right. I really don't want to wish him to be stronger than he is. I want to look at the character as he really is and not make excuses for him that make him sound "better" than he is. And I do really think that he was scared and ran because of it. Thinking about it more and more--and listening to you guys talk about it I'm much less bothered by the idea of him just running about because he was scared.

Part of the corner this character always paints himself into is that he's always sort of cutting himself off from all support so that the only way he can be scared is to be a coward. Susan Bones, for instance, doesn't come across to me as cowardly at all. She seems like a sensitive person who just needed to leave but is still bravely trying to face up to that. Because ps always presents himself as above all emotion when he is overcome with it (as he so often is) there's no dignified way for him to show it or work through it. He just has to deny it.

Anonymous @ April 17 2003, 12:34:28 UTC

What I don't understand is why everyone is saying Draco being afraid of a werewolf = Draco secretly thinks Lupin is a great guy and has come to a huge emotional realization. Why not say that for Susan Bones? Why is it okay that Susan Bones left? I personally didn't even tie Lupin's essay into the transformation. Not the same thing. And I think his lesson is being hugely disrespected by everyone saying "it was a controlled environment." He's not a puppy. It's SCARY. That is part of the POINT. That no matter how many times it happens, it's scary. It's painful. Sirius was afraid of it. Why does Draco being afraid of it have to be for the purpose of a greater good?

Personally I read potterstinks' post as it was. He was afraid of a werewolf and then tried to make himself look impressive because he realized people had seen him leave.

Would people be saying these same things if Snape were the teacher who is a werewolf? If Snape had transformed and Draco had run?

sistermagpie @ April 17 2003, 13:47:53 UTC

Hmmm...well, these are a few different things. I personally don't think that Draco's running had anything to do with him thinking Lupin was a great guy (although it may point to his acknowledging Lupin as a fellow human) or with Draco having an emotional realization. I am, however, interested in his emotional reaction, which he himself probably couldn't explain. I'm interested in Susan Bones' as well, but since she herself is honestly puzzling over her reaction I can just take her at her word. (And yes, I definitely think Draco would have run had it been Snape who was the werewolf.) In Susan's post she admitted to a great sadness at the fact that this was Professor Lupin. I'm not ready to say that PS was disturbed by that as well. Isn't that what's frightening about this whole thing anyway?

Imagine Lupin had simply brought in a fully transformed werewolf in a cage. Would the kids really have been as upset as they were by watching a man go through the horror of going from one form to the other? I admit--I'm interested in this topic far beyond this rpg and always have been: what monsters frighten people the most? What root fear do specific monsters speak to in people? The werewolf in his many guises (Dr. Jeckyl and Mr. Hyde, Psycho, The Exorcist) is one of the most primal. Of the Big Three (Frankenstein, Dracula, The Wolf Man) it's the one that hits closest to home for me. So I'm really never going to be one to say, "Eh, it's a monster so he ran," and make no distinctions about the reasons why or the circumstances.

I don't see how it's disrespectful to point out that this was a controlled environment. It is controlled--otherwise it wouldn't have been allowed. Lupin is in a cage; steps have been taken to insure safety. Everyone has been told what is going to happen. Controlled environment does not=not frightening and I didn't mean to imply it did. I meant to imply that Draco, at least intellectually, was aware that he was in relatively little danger, so I'd like to know exactly what was too frightening about it. That he claims he simply didn't trust Hogwarts to provide an adequate cage (despite it having always done so before) makes me immediately think there's more to it than that. Because I wouldn't ever trust PS to be honest about something like that.

Of course, I'm sure he'd see it just the way you do. That it was scary, he ran, he's mad, it rattled the bars etc. But he's not prone to analyzing his fears and I am. So he's stuck with me obsessively analyzing him.:-)

Anonymous @ April 17 2003, 14:59:19 UTC

I'm just wondering why ps is the only one who should have special circumstances for running from a monster. Ernie seemed prepared to be afraid of it before he went in, he took a weight loss potion for... well, it looks as though so he wouldn't have as much meat on his bones, as far as I can tell. That's why I didn't see the transformation as having as much do do with the last lesson Lupin posted. I think it would be pretty easy to forget everything you'd ever heard when you were actually faced with it, no matter *how* safe you were told you were.

Which is why I don't get why people are shrugging off the actual fear of the thing itself, just because Remus was in a cage. I think the cage would probably make it scarier. Really it's that I've been reading up on werewolves lately and thinking about how people typically tend to write them off as not so scary.

I think being told that you're safe is one of the most scary things someone can hear. There are people who are terrified of roller coasters, even though they're safe, people who are terrified of heights they have no chance of falling from, which is why I don't understand "Draco can be scared if it is something that is actually scary, which Lupin in a cage is not." Just being told that you have nothing to be afraid of can increase fear, or at least that's what I've seen. I realize this is just personal experience, but I think if someone was scared of something it wouldn't matter how much they were told.

Yes, I think it's silly for ps to be afraid of Remus, but I thought it was IC for him to make up an excuse about Hogwarts not having good cages, or whatever. Remus hasn't been in a cage at Hogwarts. He's been in the shrieking shack, so they can't *really* know if Hogwarts knows how to make cages that can hold a werewolf.

If anything I think what someone said somewhere else (can't find it...sorry!) was a good theory for why PS is afraid of it. He's afraid of becoming a werewolf, because who wouldn't be?

Anonymous @ April 17 2003, 15:04:17 UTC

YOU WILL TAKE AN LJ CODE!! Damn you anonymous posters! >:0 Ahem. Yeah, hello :D

- not logged in.

Anonymous @ April 17 2003, 15:14:45 UTC

Um, okay.

slythernefarious@yahoo.com

Thanks!... I think.

sistermagpie @ April 17 2003, 16:00:31 UTC

Oh yes, then I totally agree. I think everyone had good reason to be afraid--I would have been. Knowing intellectually that it's worked in the past doesn't mean he couldn't jump out of that cage any minute. I really don't think ps's reasons for being afraid are special--I think everybody's is interesting just because the whole thing must have been such a horrible thing to watch. So I wonder what was going through his head but I don't think there was any sort of realization on his part. In fact, I'd guess that Susan probably had a bigger emotional experience because she is ready to think about what the whole thing means.

If anything I think what someone said somewhere else (can't find it...sorry!) was a good theory for why PS is afraid of it. He's afraid of becoming a werewolf, because who wouldn't be?

Heh. That was me.:-) I have barely shut up on this thread. Seriously, though, I do think that's probably the thing Draco would focus on. So it still comes down to him just being afraid of a werewolf, but it's personalized.:-) Oh--and I'm glad you have a code now!

anamirza @ April 16 2003, 22:28:03 UTC

Malfoy didn't insult the hippogriff on purpose, though, did he? My understanding was that he simply wasn't paying attention when Hagrid said that insulting them could cause them to attack.

What seems most to me to indicate (in the werewolf lecture) that Malfoy didn't just get frightened and run off, is that that's almost what he says in his journal - that it was unsafe to be there. And really, how often is his journal a good indication of what really happened? Not that he outright lies (well, sometimes) but his capacity for self-delusion seems endless. My guess would be an unexpected emotional reaction of some kind. Sympathy, maybe, or something equally terrifying (though that may be a bit optimistic.)

sistermagpie @ April 17 2003, 07:08:37 UTC

I always assumed that he had listened but didn't think what he said really counted as an insult. I figured he thought an animal wouldn't be able to really understand an insult delivered in a sweet voice while he was petting it, so he thought he could defy the rules and therefore be disobediant without losing an arm. He was wrong.:-)

That's what I see. Just that there's something bigger going on than just the practical thing. It's like the Dementors, really. That wouldn't make Draco less fearful at all, I just think it's important somehow that we're not talking about somebody who walked into the Great Hall perfectly content and then was scared by a monster. To me, it seems like a big part of Draco's character is that he's always got fears just under the surface. It's very easy to hit a sensitive spot on him because there is that disconnect that Aja described between who he is and who he pretends to be. That's why I tend to see him being blindsided by this experience. He was ready to deal with a scary monster but not the host of other fears it may have inspired in him. But I don't mean to say those other fears have to be somehow noble. For instance, I think it's very very significant that he says, "I could have been turned into a werewolf." For somebody like Draco for whom "pureblood" means everything to his family, being turned into a werewolf would be death. He would NEVER have the kind of support that even poor Lupin had. This to me gives him all the more reason to be terrified of contamination in ways other students probably weren't. So it comes down to yes, he was scared shitless. But the fear says something more specifically about him than he's scared of everything.

Anonymous @ April 16 2003, 21:58:45 UTC perspective

Basically what everyone else said. I am *still* being amazed by the skill of the roleplayers in this RPG... from the funny things (like the coolness of Dean and shopping to the sweetness of Cho and the boy-band *Nraged) to the touching ones such as this post.

I'm also impressed at how every person has their own distinct personality and maturity level and is not always likable.

Perhaps it's also the date that's making me feeling maudlin, but I really loved this post by lupercus and how it put everything into perspective. It was actually amazingly touching and gave this RPG, which is often so many silly antics and love-triangles, a wonderful grounding and subtly sombre touch. lupercus, I kiss your hands and feet.

Really, sometimes I think potterstinks is given way more love here in nRaged than he deserves. Yeah, I am being simple-minded and blurring the line between liking a character and liking a real person all over the place... and it is undeniable that Draco's posts are always entertaining. Add to that having a huge love for the H/D...

But a post like lupercus'... added to the later ps "running away" post really drives home that ps hasn't shown that he's got much worthwhile inside yet. It also shows that the roleplayers... man, they know their stuff. I will be interested to see if potterstinks can become/ be shown to be a decent human. (...or if people think they have evidence of him acting in a semi-decent manner, please tell me... seriously, I was trying to think of an incident, but could not come up with *any*... perhaps for the possibility that he didn't tell on Harry when he snuck out to the Quidditch game...but that's so uncertain and borderline)

I am not thinking on this simply to say "hey Draco sux"... I'm wondering *what just_harry sees in him*. Lust and "he has pretty blond hair" would just be so disapointing, as Lupin said "NO ONE IS THAT GOOD IN BED"... and yet... how has Draco shown himself to be attractive in other ways? Early in the RPG, just_harry was feeling all the canon contempt one would expect, but for some reason that changed.

I am dying of curiosity as to why. Will we ever know? Were there even the slightest hints on the LJs?

Also: DEAN!! I love you! You are 500x more artistic than that poseur Boot and will look lovely in the stylin' shirt.

sistermagpie @ April 17 2003, 08:40:12 UTC Re: perspective

Well, I'm willing to admit I might be wrong in my reaction but I don't think it's so simple as my giving PS more love than he deserves. Here and in canon I think I'm pretty able to accept when he acts like a fool over and over. There's very few moments when I question exactly why he did something because it seems OOC. In this case, like I said, I'm very open to explanations. It's not like I'm trying to find a noble excuse like PS ran out because he is so sensitive to other people suffering. I've accepted he ran because he was afraid and his self-preservation instinct kicked in--that much is obvious. But all fear is different. What frightened Susan Bones may not have been what frightened PS or frightened any other student.

Even my initial scepticism about the situation doesn't make PS all that impressive. Here he has a chance to show bravery in a "safe" situation. It's not quite like going to a scary horror movie but it is very close. He's watching a scary *show* that's been organized with his safety in mind. Given that I think it's valid to wonder what was so scary to him he left anyway.

imochan @ April 16 2003, 22:27:31 UTC

Well, I know what I should be thinking, based on not only canon!Draco, but also NA!Draco. He's a coward, plain and simple.

However, I don't know what I want to be thinking. I'd like to put a twist on it, and say that - like many others are saying - his fear and cowardice is stemming not from physical fear of harm but more an emotional fear of sympathy for Lupin's pain, and the lack of comfort he might feel in such a situation. Actually, I think a combination of both types of cowardice are percolating there beneath those *rolls eyes* excuses...

but when you think about it - I agree with shusu - this shows he's back to his old tricks. And it doesn't exactly bode well for his relationship with j_h.

PS. Kudos to lupercus for one of the best NA posts i've seen. Congrats, player, whoever you are. That was bloody brilliant. <33333

shusu @ April 17 2003, 02:33:41 UTC to qualify that

Yes, I think he is back to his old tricks... but in a different way. His sniping with Harry resembles his sniping with Pansy and Millicent. In being snide with Vector he's acknowledging that he's followed her instructions. There's a lot of mean-sprited bluster ... perhaps he subconsciously sabotaged that date with Padma? I mean, has he badmouthed her yet, as usual? Or did I miss that?

As for fleeing the class... I don't think he was scared of Lupin.

I think he was scared for Lupin.

I think it hit home, and he overloaded.

As I've commented elsewhere, "There's no crying in Slytherin!"

This is a guy who is openly nice to his mother, openly fair with him, even if some of it is discipline, who has been one of the adults trying to stick up for him. To watch that excruciating thing happen to Lupin...

Guys, the kid can't change overnight. His world's been upended. It's been a rough week. Whether "mean" or "nice" he still has to save face... that's been drilled into him.

So... yes, I think he's back to his old tricks. But after watching a while, I think he's using old defense mechanisms to deal with very, very new feelings.

As to what those feelings are... well, that's the 10,000 Galleon question, huh?

greenapricot @ April 17 2003, 05:52:48 UTC Re: to qualify that

Yes, I think you're right. PS does seem to have changed a bit in the past week. It's very subtle, but I'd expect nothing less from him. He's never been one to readily admit his feelings and now that they're different, well, he's got quite a lot to think about. It's going to be very interesting watching him come to terms with everything that's happened in the last week.

Anonymous @ April 17 2003, 01:30:08 UTC

I also think that he was just scared. We know just how scary the transformation was from Hermione and Susan Bones' posts, and PS was not the only one to flee in terror, he just ran before most of the others.
But I don't think the fact that he was scared will prevent him from feeling more respect for Lupercus now that he knows what it really means to be a wereworlf and how much pain is involved. The fear was just his first instictive reaction, I guess the respect will take a little more time to hit his mind, because it will not be a primal feeling but the result of a thinking process.

~Catia

kokopoko @ April 17 2003, 10:16:49 UTC

Draco ran away from something that scared him ala the Dementor on the train in book 3.

Anonymous @ April 18 2003, 17:06:40 UTC

I'm sorry. Your icon made me die.

*is dead*

non_inferno @ April 18 2003, 17:12:41 UTC Re:

I am sorry to have killed you.